An interview between Jimmy DeYoung of Day of discovery & Prophecy Today Radio and David Dolan, twenty-plus year resident of Jerusalem and correspondent.
January 12, 2008 - David Dolan: Middle East News Update
Skepticism is very high, especially since Gaza continues to fire rockets into Israel. Continues...
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I've said it before and I'll say it again. If the United States turns against Israel, it will signal the beginning of the end.
Armageddon will be just around the bend.
I certainly hope the President knows what he's doing.
In terms of peace between Israel and the "Palestinian" people, he doesn't. Not at all. And too many people in this country's 'corridors of power' don't know what they're doing either.
Has anyone considered what happened to Lebanon?
Lebanon was the ONLY Christian nation in the middle east prior to 1970. Now there isn't even ONE Christian nation in the middle east. So what happened? Islam. How did it happen?
Lebanon was, as a Christian nation, very welcoming to other ethnic groups, and charitable to refugees; specifically the "Palestinians" who were thrust out of Jordan where Yasser Arafat had sought to dethrone King Hussein and establish a base from which to attack and drive Israel into the sea. King Hussein of Jordan killed more "Palestinians" in that period than has Israel in all her years of modern existence.
Slowly-- and yet frighteningly swift in retrospect --Lebanon began to have "problems" with the Muslim neighborhoods (much as France is having now). It wasn't long before the militants began setting up "fly by night" check-points (actions they were not authorized to do, by the way), where they stopped every vehicle to check their I.D.'s. Lebanon, at that time, placed everyone's religion (Christian, Muslim, Jew) on their I.D.'s, so when the Muslims found people-- specifically Christian --moving through their illegal check-points they shot them all in cold blood.
Soon the word got around and Christian communities chose not to travel openly. Yasser Arafat was now living in Lebanon, and using the very laws of that country against it, overwhelmed the Lebanese military, and militant Islam took over.
Christians and Jews fled-- those who could --or accepted second-class citizenship... or died. Members of the media were intimidated by Arafat and the Muslims so they tempered their reports and out-right ignored/"turned a blind eye to..." what was happening. And in under ten years Lebanon went from a Christian democratic republic to a terrorist stronghold, and puppet to Syria.
Here we have the picture of a welcoming and generous nation being swallowed whole by the ruthless ideology of Islam. There is nothing good or noble in the tenants of Islam. Nothing.
And now our President decides to demand/insist that the "Palestinian" people have "earned" the right to their own nation? A "people" whose culture is indistinguishable from Arabic culture? Has the same language, same religion, same ethnicity? The "Palestinian" people do not exist. Their existence is a myth perpetuated by ignorance. No people, especially the "Palestinians," deserve a nation of their own who have yet to stop warring against the nation they have vowed to destroy. "Palestinians" fire rockets into Israel on a near-daily basis. This is the picture of a "nation" that deserves its own national borders? I don't think so. Neither do a vast majority of Israelis.
Whatever ideology that pushed George W. Bush to insist/demand Israel give up land for peace, when it hasn't worked before, is an ideology that is steeped in Biblical ignorance and understanding.
I don't suggest George Bush isn't saved. But I do suggest that his policy suggests a lack of Christian maturity as well as Biblical understanding. That notwithstanding, he is still a far cry, as president, from John F. Kerry.
When God decides to chastise nations, he always gives them weak leaders. Bush has been strong in many respects, but he is weak, weak, weak in this.
Who we get as president next will shine a brighter light on what God has in store for this nation. But the prophetic clock began ticking in 1948. And there's not enough time left for Islam to do the same in America as it did in Lebanon. And for that I praise God, and thank Him.
He's done many things since then that aren't compatible with being a Christian. I realize the office demands some compromise, but a Christian is expected to follow God's will regardless of the circumstances. God's will is for Israel to have the land that was promised to them. God's will is for Israel to survive as a nation.
God's will is for Israel to have the land that was promised to them. God's will is for Israel to survive as a nation.
Did God die and appoint Ms Green spokesperson? How exactly does Ms Green know that this is God's Will for the modern nation of Israel and on what basis does she (and others) presume to speak on behalf of God?
Jesus (God's own Self, right) stated that "...for I say to you that from these stones God is able to raise up children of Abraham (ie, Israel)" so, even if God wished for the nation of Israel to be around "until the end of time," God has said that it could be accomplished by God's own hand.
I've withheld saying anything thus far because you all have such a different way of looking at matters of Israel than I do, but when you all are presuming to suggest national policy based on what you presume "God's Will" is, based on poor eschatology, well, this Baptist is calling for a little separation between at least your church and the state.
You want to make some reasonable suggestions about our Mideast policy based on logic, go ahead. If you want to make claims that you know what God's will is for Bush and Israel, go ahead, too. Just don't expect the rest of us to swallow it just because you say it's God's Will.
You know, there are those who suggest that "the unforgiveable sin" is blasphemy and that, further, presuming to speak on behalf of God when you don't is one way of speaking blasphemy.
Food for thought.
"...based on poor eschatology" ?
We presume too much? Yet you have a lock on "good" eschatology? Is their not a crown laid up for all who love His appearing? [2 Tim 4:8] Jesus said we wouldn't know "...the day nor the hour wherein the Son of man cometh." [Mat 25:13] But we WOULD know the "time" of His coming: "And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh" [Luke 21:28]
It's not poor eschatology to see that these are the days, and that prophecy has been fulfilled in the rebirth of Israel.
What IS poor eschatology is to take Matthew 3:9, "God is able of these stones to raise up children unto Abraham," and suggest that God could raise up a people other than the Jews and plant them in Israel. And who's to say Israel's rebirth ISN'T from God's own hand? Are YOU so presumptuous as to say it isn't?
Your comment smacks dangerously of "Replacement Theology"-- a heresy if ever there was one.
No one knows the day or the hour when Jesus will return, but the signs are all around us, and they show us that the time is near... even at the door.
Time to start looking up, for our redemption is nigh.
Time to trim our wicks, fill our lamps, and go out to meet the bride groom.
The time is now, because He comes as a thief in the night...
"For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you. For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. "
[1 Thess 4:15 - 5:2]
What are you hoping for if not this? Why should we NOT be concerned for Israel? Why should we NOT speak out against those who do not have her best interests at heart?
By what secret knowledge do you presume to accuse us of poor eschatology? Could it be you are simply unable to discern the signs of the time?
And who's to say Israel's rebirth ISN'T from God's own hand? Are YOU so presumptuous as to say it isn't?
I haven't made ANY claims about Israel. I merely pointed out that it sounds presumptuous for anyone to claim, "God's Will for Israel is to have the land promised them. God's Will is for Israel to survive as a nation."
Ms Green MIGHT have said, "As I read and understand the Bible, it seems to me that God wants and is planning for Israel to keep their land, and it concerns me that Bush..." But she didn't say that. She said flatly, "GOD'S WILL IS..."
That sounds presumptuous to me.
Here's God's will, if I may be presumptuous: That we love our neighbors as ourselves. That we Love God with all our hearts. That we love our enemies. THIS we can know to be God's will (if we think the Bible trustworthy), because it is plainly stated.
Beyond what is plainly stated, I'd wade cautiously through making any definitive political claims about nations and states - even the state of Israel.
What am I hoping for? God's kingdom come on earth as it is in Heaven. A kingdom of love and peace and justice. Where there is enough for all. Where there are no attacks upon innocents - whether by Muslims or by Christians, by Israelis or by Palestinians.
Same as you, I'd hope.
--Genesis 17:7-8
Dude. PLAINLY stated.
Furthermore, the land given to Israel encompasses ALL of modern-day Israel, Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, Gaza, the West Bank, half of Iraq, and a portion of Egypt. And one day she'll get it all. And there will be no Palestinians, Muslims, or Christians or any other divisive label we can invent. We will all be children of the Most High God.
Beware presuming to tell others what God's Will is for whole nations, unless you're sticking to the basics: Love God, Love people.
For my part, however, I say also with confidence that the Palestinians are not worthy of consideration regarding ANY land until they've certifiably repented of their wish to wipe out Israel. I'd say two or three generations of peace, love and harmony emanating from them would be a good start.
And right away, as if on cue, comes Dan, to take God's words out of context and imply God's words to Abraham were meant for people other than the Jews.
And Dan, if you are wondering why one of your comments didn't show up at my place, it is because you were being intenionally obtuse and I am tired of you continually repeating that the war in Iraq is illegal. It isn't and it's a just war. Any more pontifications on the subject will be equally rejected.
3 Unconditional Promises of God to the Nation of Israel:
The Abrahamic Covenant
The Palestinian Covenant [Having NOTHING to do with the "Palestinian" people]
The Davidic Covenant
It begins with the covenant with Abraham... unconditional, that all the nations of the world would be blessed through him and his seed..
the Palestinian covenant expounds upon the Abrahamic, and the Davidic expounds further, and more specifically concerning Messiah through David's bloodline.
But the land promised to Israel, which they have never held complete control over, consists of all of modern day Israel, all of Jordan, all of Lebanon, all of Syria, half of Iraq, all of Kuwait, three-quarters of Saudi Arabia, all of the West Bank, all of Gaza, and half of Egypt.
That's a lot of land. It's not theirs yet, but it will be. In the meantime, Israel's miraculous rebirth in a single day, is enough reason for the rest of the world to refrain from demanding Israel give away land to ingrates who care nothing of peace.
So you think Israel needs to take over part of Iraq, Syria and Jordan in order to be able to go to the Euphrates River and that this will be God's Will? How much of Iraq, Syria and Jordan must Israel occupy in order to please God? Would a swath 50 miles wide suffice or does it need to run through all of Saudi Arabia as well?
This is rather an inexact measure of God's Will. Can one of y'all tell me what God's Will is in more precise coordinates? You know, Latitude and Longitude, so we can tell Jordan, et al how much land they need to surrender in order to please God?
And you're saying that God can't come back until Israel gets all that land - that's God's Will, too? What if it takes a million years?
Or what if the only way Israel can get all that land back is by nuking the nations that currently have it, will that be God's Will?
"you're saying that God can't come back until Israel gets all that land[?]"
No. Only that that land is RIGHTFULLY Israel's. And it will one day BE theirs. Jesus will return before than happens... MUST return FOR that to happen.
What they DO possess, now, we have no... absolutely NO business telling them to give away... For ANY reason. Especially to people who will only use that land from which to launch even more rockets ever deeper into Israel than what is possible now.
The fact that Bush advocates this demonstrates his EXTREME ignorance of this Biblical truth.
The gifts and calling of God are without repentance....